Tools - Page 2

Geewizz · Post by **Geewizz** » Sat Dec 06, 2008 11:32 am

What course are you doing at college, Daniel?

Danielb · Post by **Danielb** » Sat Dec 06, 2008 2:05 pm

Geewizz wrote:What course are you doing at college, Daniel?

Carpentry and Joinery Basic City & Guilds. One of them..

Geewizz · Post by **Geewizz** » Sat Dec 06, 2008 2:11 pm

Can you just give an outline of what is involved in the course, for those of us who aren't in education?

Also, what is it that attracts you to furniture making? Just so we're all reading from the same sheet, how would you define "furniture making"?

Danielb · Post by **Danielb** » Sat Dec 06, 2008 3:25 pm

Just like the idea of furniture making, done bits of in the past but would like to do more. Something I’ve liked doing since I was a kid.

The cause I am doing is basically: http://www.cityandguilds.com/documents/ ... orking.pdf

Be easier looking there than me writing it all out I think.

Geewizz · Post by **Geewizz** » Sat Dec 06, 2008 3:33 pm

In that case, just continue using the same tools you've been using since you were a kid.

Is there a particular function that you lack a tool for?

Danielb · Post by **Danielb** » Sat Dec 06, 2008 3:41 pm

Well power tools that could help make mortise and tenons easier i guess and other stuff around them lines.

Not sure what other powers tool could help.

carhartt kid · Post by **carhartt kid** » Sat Dec 06, 2008 6:00 pm

Alright Dan

I know how you're feeling because I was once in the same position myself. In fact, I did the early C&G version of the course you're on. You'll find that you've chosen a career that brings a lot of satisfaction in producing something worthwhile. But you always have a lot of frustration thrown in for good measure. A lot of that is not having the right tool for the job.

Id say there are are a few bits of kit you'll need before you go splashing out on big bucks power tools!

Quality Hammer - Estwing or similar
Mallet - Beech or similar.
Square - Marples Rosewood ones are the best.
Tape Measure - Stanley seem to last the longest.
Saws - I like Bahco Black and Orange blade hand saws, but have Spear and Jackson and Clifton Gentlemans saws for the workshop.
Block Plane - Stanley for general work and Veritas for Workshop
Plaes in general - Theres a huge range to choose from but a good Stanley Jack/No. 4 will be a regular go to tool!
Chisels - Marples splitproof are the dogs nads, plus a finer set for workshop use like Sorby's or even some Japanese carbon steels jobbies!!
Screwdrivers - Wera or Stanley
Spanners - Bahco adjustables, ratchets and sockets
Knives - Stanley Titan and a few smaller snap off types!
Marking Knife - Japanese ones are lovely to use
Tool belt - Good brand leather.. Kunys are well respected or Makita Blue Range

I could go on and on and on!!!! I'm always buying more and more hand kit every week. Unfortunately you've chosen to be a Carpenter/ Joiner, and we seem to have to have the most kit out of all the trades!

As for power tools, well.....A good start is a Battery Drill (cordless) with nuts! 18v or 14v for shopwork. Big brand, either Dewalt, Makita or Bosch. I swear by Makita and use their Lithium range. Its the dinosaur doo!! Honestly

Then go for a corded circular saw (sometimes called a skill saw?). I started with a small diameter blade lightweight one. Till I got used to handling the spinning blade and then upgraded to a Big brand one. I'd say a "circ saw" is down to personal choice and needs. Get a feel fopr them and then see how much you can justify spending.

Router! Indeed the one thing that looks useless to the untrained eye. But is a godsend to a busy Chippie/Joiner. I have three. They come in two sizes, dictated by the collet. Thats the clamp that holds the cutter in the motor. Half inch or quarter in collet. I've DeWalt half inch for big cuts and heavy chopping out work, like worktops for kitchens, locks and tennons. I've a quarter inch DeWalt for fancy edging, dovetails and the more precise work. And finally a Bosch "Laminate Trimmer" which is basically a really small one handed router. I use this for cutting out hinges, rebating, trimming etc and is handy as its lightweight and can fit in your toolbag with all your hand tools.

Corded, electric planer! I've a bog basic Hitachi. They basically are a set of spinning blades driven by a motor by a belt. The lighter the better, as using them for long periods is tiring and you need to be switched on with them. I'm forever trimming through the power lead...Deadly!!!

There are chopsaws, mitre saws, flipsaws, rail saws, table saws (site and shop) SDS drills, hammer drills, pillar drills, nailers, pinners, trimmers, zimmers.......on and on and on. It all depends on where you end up working, and on what kind of work you do!

My Grandpa, who I did my apprenticeship and the C&G with always said. Buy the best tool you can afford, look after it and it'll last you a lifetime. And he was right. Invest carefully and wisely. Don't go blowing money on kit you will hardly use...I know as I've a friggen great Paslode Air Nailer in my loft that I'm wondering why I bought it!!

I noticed there are set tools you need to be using when doing the course. They're laid out in the exam criteria. I don't reckon the examiner would appreciate you showing up with a router and dovetail jig in the exam. The old sod's want you to do it the hard way, with a tennon saw and a chisel!

If I type any more my fingers will go numb an I'll get in trouble with the other forum gits..... miserable old gits sometimes!!

Danielb · Post by **Danielb** » Sun Dec 07, 2008 9:27 am

Thank you for that, what jobs do you do?

lockie · Post by **lockie** » Sun Dec 07, 2008 9:45 am

If you want to make furniture look up a cabinet making course. It will cover most aspects of furniture and other cross over skills that you may need from time to time.
You could end up doing upholstery,french polishing,spray finishing,wood machining,veneering,marquetry,parquetry and more. This is why it is hard to advise what you need to buy as you first need to know what you want to do.

I did a furniture making course many years ago and the stuff i listed above was all covered on the course back then so it could be even more now.
Tools are never ending,we were making handmade tools to inlay stringing veneers or make dovetail templates.

You will never have all the tools you need as something will always catch your eye and you end up with loads.You may find one old chisel at a car boot thats just right for one type of job.Its never ending and a bit addictive

apprenticejim · Post by **apprenticejim** » Sun Dec 07, 2008 11:19 am

Cant go wrong with carharrt post.

Dan your best bet is too just read everything on forums like this etc, surprised you how much you can learn

carhartt kid · Post by **carhartt kid** » Sun Dec 07, 2008 6:19 pm

Daniel,

Lockies right...Tools can be addictive. Especially shiny expensive ones. Order yourself an Axminster Catalogue http://www.axminster.co.uk/catalogue_request.asp It like a porn mag but for saddo's with sawdust in their ears and splinters in their fingers!!

About me!! Well.....

I trained as a Joiner and Cabinetmaker, working mainly building fine furniture. I spent two years as a joiner and then learnt Parquetry and then Marketry, building toy boxes, blanket boxes and repairing and restoring antiques with my Gramps! He was a master cabinet maker and French polisher. He passed away and I then went to Art college where I wanted to become a scupltor/furnitrue designer, but had to fund it by myself, so had to go to work as well. I worked in a few commercial joiners shops, but got bored with the politics, bitching and the lack of variation of work! I spent two weeks working all on my own in a ventilated room sanding! Drove me nuts!

So I registered with an employment agency. They sent me to different jobs all over and this kept me interested. I gotta admit I got kicked off a few jobs because I was naive and made a few mistakes, but that was either my own fault for being too cocky. Or I was stitched up by others as I didn't know the rules of the game. I decide during this time, I loved being a Chippie!!

Being a site/domestic carpenter required me getting my NVQ2 on top of my NVQ1 and that happened when I was taken on the books of a carpentry contractors. I found myself working on big offices, apartment blocks, shopping centres, industrial units, schools, hospitals etc etc

I loved it as it kept me interested, constantly changing, and varying work. I liked working around different people and in different places. I also love how good it feels when you hand over a project and then drive by it a year or two later. You know the place inside and out, and have seen parts of it only very few get to see. You "know it inside out" and thats a nice feeling!

I went off and did my Degree in sculpture and produced a load of sculptures that doubled as urban furniture. Stuff that could be attacked (skated, graffed, vandalised) and survive and still be beautiful!! I had to pay for this again so worked during summer breaks.

I found that being a chippie I could earn twice as much in a year than most people do. Some chip's I know can earn up to £50k. So I got back on site, and I now have my NVQ3 as well as a raft load of other tickets and cert's, and work as Contracting Carpentry/Finishing Foreman. I'm still "on the tools" because I love doing the job. I almost completely work on big commercial jobs, costing in the millions now. Great fun and really rewarding!

Hope this helps you understand a bit about what's out there! Good luck matey!!

Danielb · Post by **Danielb** » Sun Dec 07, 2008 7:22 pm

Thank you for that, it all helps.

I guess i've got a long way to go....

apprenticejim · Post by **apprenticejim** » Sun Dec 07, 2008 8:41 pm

Carharrt how old was you when you did the NVQ 3 and what was it like, my tutor has said the NVQ3 has changed over the year. This year based on what he saying it seems as if its all theory and literally hardly no practical which is no really what i expected. He says its more for construction sites and said something about an advanced diploma, something along the lines on HMN??

Il probably end up doing it anyway, if not il end up regretting it.

carhartt kid · Post by **carhartt kid** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 12:06 pm

I'm 32 Jim. Did the NVQ3 last year and it was mainly Construction site management and supervision of workers. There are several different NVQ3's in Wood Occupations. Its worth getting hold of the descriptions from City and Guilds.

Dan, i've still got a long way to go too. Thats the best bit about the job. You never stop learning and it's varied enough to keep you interested!