should i use polycell basecoat ?

[jactac]

Please help.
I have removed wallpaper and it has peeled off the paint from behind it, the walls now look like a map of China, i have now used polycell filler on the patch's and intend to lightly sand back, however i think the patch's will show through unless i use something before painting, i was advised in B&Q to use polycell basecoat, however i have since been told that this may "bubble" on the filled patches, so can anyone please offer advice on what to use. I have stud walls therefor a pain in the rear to sand.
I may even repaper it. lol.

[Jaeger_S2k]

Just used Zinzer (think that's the spelling) Bullseye 123 on some, well actually a lot of filler and easy-fil patches to a mess of a wall and it covered perfectly with one coat.
I emulsioned with vinyl matt about 2 hours later.

Finish was perfect.

[Puma]

A thinned emulsion (20% with water or a bit more for Dulux trade) will stick fine to the filler. The problem is marrying up the textures. It is impossible to tell without pictures but a couple of normal rolled coats of paint at full or near full thickness will normally cure the problem.

[jactac]

So dont bother with polycell base coat ? can i get zymmer from the likes of b&q ?
sorry zinzer

-- Thu Apr 29, 2010 9:21 am --

just googled zinsser 123, it seems to be more of a bonding agent rather than something that will "even" out the patch's befor a final coat.
i have used polycell dasecoat in the past, it was good for giveing an "even" finish but i did in places have this problem of it slightly bubbling and lifting.
maybe i should use a bonding agent before the basecoat ?
at this rate it would be cheaper to have the walls replastered.

[Puma]

Sorry Jactac did not realise the Polycell was a high build paint. This leaves a thick film which should marry up textures fairly well. I haven't used it. You should wash the walls down to get rid of any residual paste. You can prime the bare filler with almost anything to improve the adhesion - thinned undercoat, or primer, or thinned matt emulsion all should do very well. The Polycell is a really thick looking product, they often lay on top of the surface rather than seeping in and sticking well, so priming the filler in anyway is probably a good idea.

Zissner is a excellent product, quick to use and known to stick well to anything (except glossy surfaces), but is expensive and it is often possible to get around using it with a cheaper product.

Let us know how it goes - I might have to use it at some stage.

[fordy]

I havent used it, but would imagen you'll be disapointed by it claims and subsequent performance.

Rub it down and try to feather the edges off. Then id paper using 2000.

If your anything like me you wil not be happy with filling and painting the wall.

Depends on time , money etc good luck

[jactac]

THANKS FOR YOUR REPLIES, GOT MY WORK CUT OUT I THINK.
SANDING IS THE NEMASIS OF ALL MEN.........................

-- Thu Apr 29, 2010 7:17 pm --

can i use pva to seal the filler before painting ?

[Jaeger_S2k]

Right let me try again.

You've got patches of plaster removed from stripping paper?

You've filled and still have patches that will show i.e. highs and lows?

[jactac]

yes sort of,
the paper when it was removed pulled off the paint from underneath, leaving patch's everywhere, my walls are not plastered as they are dry lined, i think they are skimmed with "aymes", might of spelt that wrong.
Anyway, where the paint has been pulled off you can see the skimming. i have now tried to fill out these patch's with polyfiller and sanded back to try and level the patch's out but its not fantastic. i think it will show through if i now go for painting, thing is if i keep filling and sanding i'm starting to get down to the plaster board, so is there any product i can now use before i paint to try and give a good enough finish before painting.

[Jaeger_S2k]

Ah, Makes more sense.
My answer was for bleed through of or pulling (shadowy drying) of the paint.

I'd use Easy-Fill or Easy-Fill 45. You can get it really creamy and smooth, apply over the patches with a proper trowel just as you would with plaster. It's really easy to sand as it's soft, I'd take the worse off with say 120 grade and finish smooth with a 240 or 320 grade. Just work slowly and evenly. If done properly you won't see a thing.

Now dependant on the area you are filling, when you paint over you will probably see pulling of the paint and the filler will absorb the paint more than the surrounding area. This can take 4 to 5 coats to cover up. If it's smaller localised patches take a weak mix of oil based undercoat thin with white spirit and brush over the filler allow to dry, mild 240, 320 sanding and emulsion.

If the areas are larger, then Zinzer bullseye 123 which will both stop the pulling and help bind the paint over the filler.

It's difficult to decide which way you should go as we can't see what you can. I have dry lined both our utility and kitchen and have (in the utility) cut out a section of plasterboard and refitted, filled with easy fill, sanded and painted you'd never know it was done.

Cut out section...


Refitted ....


Part filled ....


Don't have a photo of that actual part but I'll happily get one tomorrow if you need it. Here's an example of the finish you can achieve with Easy Fill.....

Dry lining .....





The same area finished....

[jactac]

jaeger,
thanks for your reply and pics.
i've already filled the patch's with polyfiller and sanded back to what i think will not show throw , hopefully.
the patch's are widespread, some thumb size other's A4 size and a bit bigger maybe. They have sanded back quite well, so basicaly it's ready for sealing before painting, i've got PVA here but i'm a bit unsure whether to use that or use some watered down emulsion, i've also got some undercoat (think its water based though), does it have to be oil based ?
what do you think i should go with to seal/prime the filler ?
or should i not bother with what i have here and buy another product to seal/prime ?

[Jaeger_S2k]

Hi jactac,
Have a look at this thread on PVA and paint. The answer is no.

If the areas are widespread and could be coated easily then thinned undercoat, if they are so wide spread that you would be painting most of the wall then primer.

Really needs to be oil undercoat as you're introducing a barrier to the filler to kill it's absorbency (although Zinzer Bullseye 123 is a 'wash your brushes in soapy water'. But I think the clues is in the soapy water bit).

Bullseye 123 isn't cheap but the finish I got was really impressive, I did patch some filler in a ceiling with undercoat and it's just as effective, don't be put off by the immediate result of painting emulsion over the undercoat (if you go this route) as the patch will take longer to flatten/dry as it isn't being pulled by the patch below, it will look patchy but will flatten out fine.

It's difficult to say what you should do, it tends to be an on the job decision you can see how much patching has been done. I rollered the Bullseye as it was quicker than patching with undercoat.

Oh and Bullseye is/was on offer at Johnstones around £30 for 2.5 ltr.

[fordy]

Your tap looks like hes got a boner

[Jaeger_S2k]

Your tap looks like hes got a boner