Travertine floor tiles

[JS2004]

Hi guys,

Bit of a newb here when it comes to DIY.

I have some travertine tiles to lay on my 1st floor bathroom floor which I am in the process of completely gutting and renewing. I have never really used travertine before.

The tiles are rectangular and roughly 30 cm by 15 - 20 cm. Some are quite solid, some are rather porous and some are in between.

The bathroom floor is currently floorboard, which look like they are new, tightly laid and also level and solid. I have been advised to simply tile onto this surface however I an concerned for the following reason - Whilst sealing the tiles, some of them are breaking (despite handling them with care). Additionally, a few were drying on the floor (solid, level floor) and I stepped on them and they broke.

My main concern is that I am going to lay these tiles directly onto the floor boards only to have them crack, water seep through and it in turn ruin the floorboards underneath and potentially the kitchen ceiling.

I have looked at products on the market and found "Aquapanel" however before going out and buying this stuff I am hoping to find a bit of information and guidance as to how this should be laid, or if it should be used at all. I intend to try and pick out the most solid tiles and use those and keep the more porous ones (although I do like their look) aside and do something else with them.

The floor area to be tiled is approx 2 sq mtr.

I do have some ply but it only looks like its 3mm thick. The person who advised me against using the ply said that the floor is solid, and by using the ply I am introducing a flex which runs the risk of damaging the tiles and causing the same problem that I am worried about by not using anything in between the floor boards and the tiles.

Sooo hopefully someone can point me in the right direction and give me a bit of a newbie guide to travertine laying 101 :)

Cheers

[wine~o]

Did you prime the floorboards ?

If not the addy can cause the boards to swell..

Also what adhesive are you using ? you must use a flexible adhesive suitable for natural stone and ensure they are laid on a full bed...


EDIT....Ooooops manners.....

[darrenba]

Travertine is too fragile to be laid just on floorboards. Overboard with aquapanel/cement board which needs to be glued and screwed. Then lay the Travertine on top. As has been mentioned use a suitable flexible adhesive too.

Here's one I did last month

[DTWCeramics]

I recommend 18mm or thicker Ply for Travertine, or using a product such as Schluter - Ditra Matting, use a thick bed of slow setting white adhesive (24hr) and ensure that tiles are pressed down fully into the compound and given the full 24 hrs before foot traffic.

the reason the tile's broke when you've stood on it, is because the back is unfilled, and you've put great strain on an extremely fragile piece of stone.

seal before you grout, following the advice of your sealer, then seal again once the grout has dried (24 hrs or so)

Cheers.

[JS2004]

Thanks for the replies guys.

My plan at the moment then is to obtain some aquapanel.

What would I need to use to prime the floor boards prior to laying the aquapanel on top of them?

My understanding is:

Prime floorboards (Not sure what to use)
Screw aquapanel onto floorboards (seems to be specific aquapanel screws being sold from Wickes)
prime the aquapanel with glue (not sure what type??)
Leave for 24 hours
Use thick bed slow setting white adhesive on the floor - pressing tiles into this firmly (Are 2mm spacers fine for this?)
Leave for 24 hours
Grout between all the gaps / clean excess grout off
Leave 24 hours
Final coat of sealant

Does that plan sound about right? Also if those blanks in terms of products could be filled I would appreciate it :)

As for the adhesive I currently have it is one that the tile supplier recommended but I think it is their own brand. Al-Murrads tiles - it says flexible white adhesive.

Thanks guys.

[wine~o]

Thanks for the replies guys.

My plan at the moment then is to obtain some aquapanel.

What would I need to use to prime the floor boards prior to laying the aquapanel on top of them?

My understanding is:

Prime floorboards (Not sure what to use)Not necessary
Screw aquapanel onto floorboards (seems to be specific aquapanel screws being sold from Wickes)Correct
prime the aquapanel with glueNot necessary. you are using cement based board. (not sure what type??)
Leave for 24 hoursOnly if you need a rest
Use thick bed slow setting white adhesive on the floor - pressing tiles into this firmly (Are 2mm spacers fine for this?)Fine, slight twisting/sliding to ensure a full bed of adhesive
Leave for 24 hours
Grout between all the gaps / clean excess grout offSounds about right
Leave 24 hoursDouble check for bits of stubborn grout
Final coat of sealant

And Bob is yor Mothers Brother, (or a goldfish...go on ask his name....)

Does that plan sound about right? Also if those blanks in terms of products could be filled I would appreciate it :)

As for the adhesive I currently have it is one that the tile supplier recommended but I think it is their own brand. Al-Murrads tiles - it says flexible white adhesive.

Thanks guys.

[JS2004]

Excellent - thank you very much guys I shall get a crack on with this now that I have some clear direction!

One last thing - the tiles themselves. They are porous on the underside - I assume that It would be wise to fill the holes on the underside with the adhesive and coat the underside with a little more adhesive prior to laying them.. would that be wise or will it cause problems? (I dont know if the stuff expands on setting etc).

A goldfish..? 2 haribos on his name being Fred :)

[darrenba]

The Aquapanel/HardieBacker will need a bed of adhesive under it, so the floorboards will need priming - check adhesive for their recommended primer. Sometimes PVA is OK, sometimes you need a proper primer.

Here are the installation instructions taken from the James Hardie installation guide.

INSTALL CEMENT BACKERBOARD TO SUBFLOOR
• Apply a gap filling bed of non-flexible tile adhesive to the subfloor using a 6mm notched trowel.
• Embed HardieBacker Cement Backerboard with a sliding motion firmly and evenly in the wet tile adhesive.
• Use the EZ Grid fastener pattern as a guide. Fasten HardieBacker Cement Backerboard with specified nails or screws every 200mm over the entire surface. Keep fixings between 15mm from board edges and 50mm from board corners.
• Set heads of fixings flush with the surface without overdriving.

[Colour Republic]

Check for deflection. Sort out if needed

Backer boards down, glued and screwed. Yes prime the floor boards first.

Comb addy on to floor, back skim each tile with the flat side of the trowel filling the holes. Use white cement based adhesive. Try to get 100% coverage/bed

Seal tiles, grout, seal again.

If your tiles are breaking that easy They might be very poor quality. So they will need to be supported very well to stand any chance of not cracking

[JS2004]

Cheers all - I will see how it all goes - hopefully I can get it done without too many mistakes !

I am only planning on laying the aquapanel down where it will be tiled - as I am not tiling under the bath (seems pointless to me..?) so the panel will just go far enough that the bath panel can cover over the top.

[All The Gear]

Sorry mate, I'd never use a 2mm grout line on a floor. You'd want a 4mm minimun I'd say, and a flexi grout.

[JS2004]

Quick update

Progress has been a little slower than anticipated due to an issue with the shower fittings but we are now all-go again.

The plumbing has been done and floorboards screwed back down. These have been primed with the recommended primer 1:1 dilution. I gave the boards two coats.

I am now going to lay the aquapanel. I will put down a 6mm flexible adhesive bed using a notched trowel and then screw the boards down whilst using a level to ensure that the floor does stay level. I have never done stuff like this before but in theory it sounds straight forward enough.

Once the panels are down I will leave it for a day or so before beginning with the tiles.

Fingers crossed it will be relatively straight forward.

I will pick up some 3 or 4 mm spacers for the tiles also and I have already managed to cut the tiles that needed to cut. Went quite well considering I had not cut them before and I only had one mishap where the tile broke as I was nearing the edge of it with the cutter.

The tiles which had broken previously were quite porous so I have picked out all of the solid ones for the floor as the actual measurements of them is 20cm by 10cm so there were plenty to pick from.

[JS2004]

Following up on this here are the results.

I think I have made a slight mistake in that I sealed the tiles (unfilled) before I grouted.. so hopefully this is not a problem but if it is I will be able to regrout (fingers crossed).

I really like the results and although it may not be to everyones tastes (one of my friends hates it) its pretty much the effect I was after.

I have also made a plinth to go underneath the mantle piece in the front room - this will replace a horrible *pink* marble plinth.. and now I have about 40 tiles left to make a mirror out of :)

I am having slight difficulty cleaning the grout from the tiles at the moment but I have picked up a tough sponge and this seems to give better results. I am using the sealant on them with this sponge but after reading up some more threads I will give hot water a try.

Its still a work in progress though so please ignore the mess / unfinished bits :)

[DTWCeramics]

Looks great JS :)

I'd have personally gone with a tone lighter grout, but it still looks awesome. Little tiles like this are getting really popular ATM.

RE: cleaning grout, pick up a "Scotch 3M Emulsifying Pad" - They won't damage the tiles but the grout residue will come straight off.

Cheers