New build studwork

[MSX]

I'm not a fan of housebashing but went working with one of my mates last weekend for a decent sum! I'm a second year apprentice but this was the hardest thing I've come across and done on my own yet. The developer is Miller Homes, I'll try and get a few 2nd fix snaps tomorrow, I took 3 more but they haven't come out right so unfortunately I've only got the one for now

First floor drawing

Studding220813plan.png (98.18 KiB) Viewed 5744 times

The business end

Studding220813.png (840.59 KiB) Viewed 5744 times

MSX

[182michael]

Sheet the ceiling first saves so much time. Also stagger the dwangs so they are easier to nail.

[ayjay]

Also stagger the dwangs so they are easier to nail.

That always looks ugly and amateurish to me, (and doesn't provide support for p/b at the joint if the boards are fixed horizontally).

Is it really that difficult to nail noggins in a line? Serious question, cos I've heard the theory before but never had a problem doing it in a straight line.

[philprime]

I always fix noggings in a straight line never had any problems doing it both with a nail gun or with a hammer and nails

[182michael]

Just out of habit I guess, looks far from amateurish though.

[steviejoiner74]

Always sheet ceiling first msx!! Personally I always fix dwangs(noggins) staggered but will do a straight row if neccesary. Horizontal plasterboard on walls I would never do ayjay but I know it's done a bit more down south for some reason. Do the joiners do the boarding in England/Wales as well as the stud work or is it done by plasterers?

[ayjay]

Do the joiners do the boarding in England/Wales as well as the stud work?

I'm never first in the queue for tacking.

[MSX]

Do the joiners do the boarding in England/Wales as well as the stud work or is it done by plasterers?

On the sites I've been on in the past year boarding has always been done by a drylining firm who then subby to plasterers to skim it I believe. Either that or you'll get the plastering firm doing both

[steviejoiner74]

Is drylining classed as a 'trade' south of the border? When we do a house from start to finish it's the whole thing from erecting the timber frame and roof to plaster boarding then doors/facings/skirting and kitchen. Judging by what I've read on this forum the trades seem to be a bit more fragmented in England. Is it a 4 year apprenticeship you do msx? And does it cover every aspect of being a joiner/carpenter up here in Scotland it is a 4 year apprenticeship with the same firm on which it is mostly site based with block release first and second year at college which gives you nvq level 3. Third year you can go and do advanced craft if you wish and before the end of forth year you do a trade skills test.

[MSX]

I don't think drylining is classed as a trade here, but you do get firms solely dedicated to drylining and drylining only. Most of the firms I've come across tend to throw the whole package in on a housebashing site - drylining, skimming, rendering, metal stud (if apartments), floor screeding etc. I wish my apprenticeship was like that, lol, mine only lasts 18 months and gives you the basic wood occupations qualification along with an NVQ 2 in site joinery.

The firm I'm with don't do new builds, this was just something I did with an older mate of mine (cash in hand) last weekend and today. I've only ever been on one housebashing site doing houses start to finish - Redrow homes - that was us joisting it, boarding it, putting the roof on, strapping the roof, studding out, putting the stairs in, window cills, door frames, etc -- 1st fix, then the 2nd fix of skirting, architraves/facings, doors, boxing in pipes, balustrade kits if any. I've fitted kitchens with a kitchen fitter domestically but have never done it on sites, they usually get kitchen fitting firms in so in a way joiners here aren't as diverse as those in Scotland

I have to get evidence of both 1st and 2nd fix for my qualification. I've got the majority of it, I'm just holding back a lot of photos so I can get more time and experience on sites before I finish my time because Carillion (the company I'm doing my apprenticeship with) get rid of you as soon as you have enough evidence to pass the written and practical tests. I do have the option to do an NVQ 3 with Carillion but I'm doing it elsewhere because the teaching standards are awful and 90% of the lads I know at Carillion are only there for an apprentice wage. I was in college for 9 months straight and now I'm on sites (because I'm holding back my evidence lol) until February, then I finish up about April.

[joinerjohn]

Stevie, boy,,, down here most plastering contractors prefer to do their own dry lining and plastering. I find it easier to put the stud work up before the ceilings are boarded, even if it means putting extra noggins (dwangs) for the plasterer to board to at the edges of rooms. As for the noggins on studwork, I usually stagger them, as most ceiling heights mean the plasterer can use a full length board, so the only joints are vertical anyway.

[steviejoiner74]

Is there any particular reason joiners don't do the plasterboarding in England John? I take it most new houses are plaster skimmed in your area too. Rarely is it done here,everything is Ames taped. I noticed from a few photo's on here as well that roofs don't get sarking or osb ply on them before felting and battening,new one to me as well! This is a really good forum,loads of info on all sorts of stuff. Really interesting to see the different methods used all over the country

[royaloakcarpentry]

Close boarded roofs are a Scottish thing only really done in England when the position is exposed.

The plaster boarding down here is done by separate gangs and not the carpenters. At least not on new build sites. Smaller work, it may well be the carpenter doing it. At one time they used to have teams in and all they did was tacking.



The stud work is not done as per the old way of being taught during City&Guilds. We used to have to let the uprights into the head and sole plate.

[steviejoiner74]

Sadly royaloak,the old skills are getting lost to the guys coming into the trade,few can cut mitres by hand or hang a door with hand tools. Mitre saws and nail guns are great but young guys rely on them heavily from the first day of their apprenticeship now. Too many guys seem to be one trick ponies now,kitchen fitting for example. In my eyes that ain't a trade but apparently it is nowadays! Same with kit erecting or metal studding,just my opinion tho

[royaloakcarpentry]

My first year was sawn timber only and it had to be prepared by hand. No machines allowed.

That is what is lacking now. How can you only learn second fix? That means you have no appreciation of what you are fitting and if it is correct to be fitted.

I still would not have an apprentice with me that is allowed to use power tools in the first year.