Good evening, I have a few questions regarding how to add a loft light from an existing circuit and I will do my best explain what I know so far and I have attempted to show it by using a paint and attaching it, so apologises for my bad drawing in advance, also not sure how to get the paint image to show full size sorry)
The upstairs house lights appear to be wired live to the switch and then a switched live to the ceiling rose, with a neutral run from ceiling rose to ceiling rose and the neutral appears to just end at the landing light.
( the live for the next switch is taken from the previous one and so on. It's a house built mid 1960's and guess it was wired thus to save on cable costs.)
I have easy access to all wiring more or less, only bar two ceiling roses, as access to the eaves is boarded from the main loft area and I have to get through a small cut out.
I have three questions really:
1: In order to add a loft light with it's own switch, is possible to simply cut the live to bathroom switch (last live is wired to this), add a junction box for live to the new loft light switch, switched live from the switch to new light fitting and run a neutral from the landing ceiling rose to the new light fitting?
2: Is it normal for the neutral to simple just end at the last light fitting?
3: And lastly is it ok for the landing light to have the neutral as it is, as it's live is run from a 2 way switch in the hall downstairs, so should it not take it's neutral from the downstairs also?
( I would like to just mention that apart from one cable which is twin & earth (landing light switch live), the wires in use are double insulated single core for neutral and double insulated single core and earth for the live and switched live. Old black & red colours)
Any help/advice would be greatly appreciated, and apologises if I have explained things poorly. Many thanks for your time.
Adding a loft light and switch
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Someone-Else
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Adding a loft light and switch
1) You don't seem to have much choice. Use wagos and a wago box, not a junction box.
2) What else would you do with it? (Normally the live and earth would finish at the last light too)
3) Where do you suppose it is coming from?
FYI. If it was run in twin and earth, it was the norm to run L,N to the ceiling rose then L and switched L to the switch, but now with the advent of smart switches the supply is looped at the switch with only SL & N to the light, that way there is a N at the switch so a smart switch can work. Like you, I omitted the earth, but they are there.
You should use twin and earth, for your additions, since it is easier than buying singles.
2) What else would you do with it? (Normally the live and earth would finish at the last light too)
3) Where do you suppose it is coming from?
FYI. If it was run in twin and earth, it was the norm to run L,N to the ceiling rose then L and switched L to the switch, but now with the advent of smart switches the supply is looped at the switch with only SL & N to the light, that way there is a N at the switch so a smart switch can work. Like you, I omitted the earth, but they are there.
You should use twin and earth, for your additions, since it is easier than buying singles.
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Maxen
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Adding a loft light and switch
Many thanks for your reply.
I had considered using a wago box or a hager J803 but thought I could get away with a normal junction box as I would have access to it, but will now use a wago box as per your advice.
My apologies regarding question two, as you can tell I am not well versed with electrics and genuinely thought when a circuit was talked about it mean't just that 'a circle' back to fuse box. In hindsight rather idiotic thinking about it now when I literally had the evidence in front of me with as you pointed out the live and earth just end at the last light.
With regards to point 3 I thought it was an issue of the landing light causing a shared neutral as it takes it from the upstairs (bathroom) and live from the downstairs (hallway 2 way switch) ,might install the loft light and have someone by check both it and what I believe is an issue with the neutral. Which is probably fine and I'm really just over thinking everything because why chance it.
Thanks again for your help.
I had considered using a wago box or a hager J803 but thought I could get away with a normal junction box as I would have access to it, but will now use a wago box as per your advice.
My apologies regarding question two, as you can tell I am not well versed with electrics and genuinely thought when a circuit was talked about it mean't just that 'a circle' back to fuse box. In hindsight rather idiotic thinking about it now when I literally had the evidence in front of me with as you pointed out the live and earth just end at the last light.
With regards to point 3 I thought it was an issue of the landing light causing a shared neutral as it takes it from the upstairs (bathroom) and live from the downstairs (hallway 2 way switch) ,might install the loft light and have someone by check both it and what I believe is an issue with the neutral. Which is probably fine and I'm really just over thinking everything because why chance it.
Thanks again for your help.
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Someone-Else
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Adding a loft light and switch
The neutral issue is known as Borrowed Neutral.
Your diagram shows both live and neutral coming from downstairs, if this is true there is nothing you can do about it.
In an ideal world you would have an upstairs lighting circuit and a downstairs lighting circuit, neither having anything to with the other.
Your diagram shows both live and neutral coming from downstairs, if this is true there is nothing you can do about it.
In an ideal world you would have an upstairs lighting circuit and a downstairs lighting circuit, neither having anything to with the other.
Above are my opinions Below is my signature.
Would you hit a nail with a shoe because you don't have a hammer? of course not, then why work on anything electrical without a means of testing Click Here to buy a "tester" just because it works, does NOT mean it is safe.
If gloom had a voice, it would be me.
Click Here for a video how to add/change pictures
Inept people use the QUOTE BUTTON instead of the QUICK REPLY section
Would you hit a nail with a shoe because you don't have a hammer? of course not, then why work on anything electrical without a means of testing Click Here to buy a "tester" just because it works, does NOT mean it is safe.
If gloom had a voice, it would be me. Click Here for a video how to add/change picturesInept people use the QUOTE BUTTON instead of the QUICK REPLY section