Not quite energy saving, but cost of drying clothes?

[ericmark]

I say not energy saving, as we need to put a cost on our time, ideal clothes drying is likely under a car port, so no bird lime, or rain problems, however we must include the time to hang the cloths out, and to complete final drying.

My wife likes her trousers pressing, so there is no real extra cost using the trouser press, steam press or hand held iron to finish off the drying for some cloths, but many homes no longer have an airing cupboard or a plate warmer on top of the solid fuel cooker to finish drying the cloths.

We also need to consider how damp the house will get, bedroom today sitting at 53% humidity but if I was drying cloths in the bedroom that would not be the case.

So in the main we are forced to tumble dry cloths to ensure not re-wetted, or covered in bird lime, requiring a re-wash, and requiring a reasonable amount of labour to complete the process, our labour saving devices have freed the house wife so she can go out to work, so we must put on the time taken to wash cloths and dry them the labour costs at minimum wage at least.

So we have four main ways to remove the water from the cloths and our homes.
1) Blow the damp air outside.
2) Condense the moisture using cold water to cool heat exchanger.
3) Condense the moisture using ambulant air to cool heat exchanger.
4) Both heat the cloths and condense the moisture using a heat pump to cool heat exchangers.
We have assigned names, 1) Vented, 2) Washer/drier, 3) Condenser, 4) Heat pump. The condenser is vented, so heats up the room it is in, the washer/drier wastes water, the heat pump can release green house gases, some need tanks emptying, many need fluff filters cleaning, some need holes drilling in the wall, in the winter the vented is pumping out central heating air and also drawing in air which is likely not that dry to start with, so placing the units in a warehouse to compare them is hardly a valid test, and we need to consider the room they take up.

OK maybe I am lucky, we do not need to mix cooking and laundry, we have a unheated utility room, and to start with we used a vented dryer with hose out of window, which was left open 24/7, and a bolt on the utility room door to keep rest of house secure, the dryer had two main options 1 kW or 2 kW, we always used 1 kW as otherwise had a tendency to trip on over heat.

So I had two options, drill a hole in wall for the vent, or get a tumble drier that did not need a vent. Since it seems vented dryers are being phased out, seemed better to go for one not needing a vent. Since the utility room is small, a condenser dryer would mean room got rather hot, so went for a heat pump dryer.

However it does take a long time, a small load takes around 2.5 hours.

Tuesday 2 start small load.jpg (17.39 KiB) Viewed 4843 times

Tuesday 5 finsih small load.jpg (23.37 KiB) Viewed 4843 times

the heat up time seems same for all load sizes, the maintaining with the heat pump cutting in and out can extend the dry time to 5 hours with a large load.

The vented dryers did have the option of using less power over a long time, seem to remember a 250 watt model designed to dry over night, so not really comparing like with like, and the old vented had no moisture detection so one set for 90 minutes then checked to see if dry or not.

I am pleased with the change, as we can now close the window, but as to being more economical not so sure, did not have a 500 watt option on the vented dryer to compare it with.

In the back kitchen we still have an old cheap washer/dryer, where we can put the washing in, walk away, and return a week latter if we wish to clean dry washing, were we need to move washing from the washing machine to dryer within a day or it's going to start to smell.

I know we are retired so time does not cost the same as when we went out to work, but even at half minimum wage putting cloths out to dry is a non starter if I consider my wife's time as important.

So what does the team think? It would make a good radio program, but how does the rest of the country dry their cloths?

[moderator2]

Edited to read "clothes".

[Someone-Else]

Edited to read "clothes".

I noticed that the first time I read it, but I have to ask, as you have changed the title from cloths to clothes, should you not change all the other cloths to clothes too (all 9 of them) or just change the title back to cloths and ignore the errors.

[moderator2]

I'm sure our members are intelligent enough to work out that there are "e"'s missing from the rest of the post.

[Argyll]

I noticed that the first time I read it, but I have to ask, as you have changed the title from cloths to clothes, should you not change all the other cloths to clothes too (all 9 of them) or just change the title back to cloths and ignore the errors.

Take the day off mate.

[kellys_eye]

My dear departed mum used to swear by her neighbours spinner..... mum couldn't afford her own when we were kids so was constantly using her neighbour friends spinner to get our nappies (diapers for the yanks on here) 'touch dry' before hanging them out for the rest of the drying process.

Seems like spinners have been forgotten and reliance on the spin ability of washing machines is the norm - however I don't believe (an may well be proven wrong here as it's a loooong time ago) that modern washing machines are as effective as the old stand-alone spinners were.

[big-all]

i used to have a 1600rpm and clothers where as near as it touch dry modern machine 1400 no where near as good 1600 would be an extra £50 never could pay for its self as at an extra unit to dry that used to be 12p now 20p [average over perhaps 10 years}as i only do a wash around every 2 weeks at say an extra 20p a unit towards drying so 10p a week =£5 a year or 10 year pay back not a good return before it was £10 per extra 200rpm spin speed so a no brainer

[London mike 61]

Here is what we do ;
Summer
Wash at 40 degrees, hang outside . Job done
Winter.
Wash 40 degrees , then spin the clothes / laundry at 1400 rpm to get extra moisture out. Place ironable clothes on heated airer ( because it’s really cheap to run and is highly effective ) the rest goes in the tumble dryer unless a sunny day , then we lay everything out in the unheated conservatory to dry.

That’s it

Mike

[aeromech3]

My partner has an LG twin tub, I tried to convince her to get an automatic so that she does not have to attend the machine, but she loves hanging the washing out in the fresh air and as k_e remarked the separate spinner drum does a good job for the not delicate clothes. The downside is it is not pumped and needs gravity emptying and I have to regularly clear coins etc from the plunger type valve and under the agitating scroll.
A new machine price equates to £160 whereas the auto at least £280, also with most auto's a cold wash is still 30*C which means the heater will kick in and cost more in electricity.
In UK I have a Siemens D12-52 which will dry, has no vent front or back, but I think it uses a condenser and pumps out during drying but takes forever to do a load; so for me its washing line of drying rack in the kitchen near a rad; for a single user no damp issues.

[Argyll]

I use my dehumidifier in my spare room. Always set to 55%. Clothes dry the next day.

[ericmark]

I do remember the days with a twin tub and a mangle between them and hanging out washing on a line under the car port. Monday washing day we never got a hot meal, as the kitchen was used as a laundry room. Floor covered with clothes, and my wife was far more frugal with the amount she changed her clothes.

I see no point in either getting the room damp, or running a dehumidifier, when the water can be directed either outside as water vapour or down a drain.

I like the idea of a covered area to dry clothes in, but that is expensive, and the amount of birds putting washing out to dry without some cover is a non starter. My fault I know, I feed the birds, but I like watching them.

So two types of tumble dryer, the vented with large pipe, either through core bored hole, or window, or I have even used the cat flap. Or the condenser.

The condenser also split into three types, water cooled, air cooled, or refrigeration plant cooled. The water cooled wastes water, and with my washer/dryer the temperature of the re-circulated air seems rather high, the air cooled also has a problem in that it heats the room that it is in, so needs to be in a large room, and my utility room is not that big. The refrigeration plant type uses the heat pump both to heat and cool, so puts less heat into the room.

So theroy is the heat pump is the best option, however I think my problem is not the dryer, but how it is used? I selected mixed, and put a load through it, and got this

Monday Aug 28 all.jpg (37.7 KiB) Viewed 4762 times

result on the energy meter, a lot less energy used to the earlier attempts.

There is a balance, spin speed, and dryer heat to damage done to clothes, and I have never really worked it all out, I know new clothes are a problem as no idea if colours will run, but old clothes we still tend to split into colours, this is likely not the best idea in terms of drying, cotton and wool need different treatments, mainly down to heat, but if you can cool the drying air to below ambient then one can reduce the heat required.

I have had no reports of damaged clothes due to using mixed, so it seems that's the way to go.