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Stoday wrote:Hoovie's last two posts demonstrate the point I was trying to make. Neither quote the amount of light It's no use knowing how many watts, you need to know how many lumens.

product description Colour Number of LEDs Power consumption Radiation angle Light strength
LED bulbs, 12 LEDs 230V GU10 ... White 12 0.75 W 8° 65 Lux
LED lights, 20 LEDS 230V GU10 ... White 20 1.25 W 10° 95 Lux

There's some values for you taken from the website I got the 1st pic from.- mabe I should have copied the whole website into the message for you

I don't think anyone has claimed they are as bright as 'normal' lights, so it is a matter of 'horses for courses'

and BTW, it IS useful knowing the wattage as that helps know how much it costs to run, does it not, which is a useful bit of info! Just because the wattage does not tell you the brightness does not mean it is no use

BTW Stoday, were you born a cantankerous old sod, or did you train for it ?

Stods - as I've said I'm clueless on this subject and I've also queried whether LED is still a gimmick.

I'm after advice as to what is the 'norm' for lighting under soffits, if LED is rubbish then I'll revert to something else - but what are the options ?

I'm more thinking of ambient lighting now and when the decking is installed then I'll worry (and bother you lot again) about what to light it with.

My main concern is cabling up the soffit area as I may be in a position to seal off my roof area this w/e so I need to decide on what lighting I should use so I can determine what cables to install

Ski. Ive just skimmed over this, you mentioned not wanting transformers, most transformers are reducing 240v to 12v, they are usually wired into the main lighting circuit as I have done in the living room. I have three transformers up there, when they fail a few months or years, they will be retrieved through the nearest downlighter hole and replaced, and they are on the normal switches.

Most people wouldn't recognise a 100 lumen light if they smacked there face in it!
Buy one and try it, if it gives an acceptable output buy some more if it doesn't buy a bigger one.

FFS it's soffit lights not the reading room at the local library?

Shower enclosures, 240v, LED lights, just don't believe all you read on forums

The trouble with transformers is I'll have to put them in the soffit. Open to the temperature variances as well as the risk out moisture as well as the problem of access

skiking wrote:My main concern is cabling up the soffit area as I may be in a position to seal off my roof area this w/e so I need to decide on what lighting I should use so I can determine what cables to install

Through some 1mm or 1.5mm up there and sufficient to switch and accessible feed and close it off.

Hoovie wrote:BTW Stoday, were you born a cantankerous old sod, or did you train for it ?

Why??

All I'm trying to do is to help skiking to avoid an expensive mistake.

You still haven't quoted how much light is produced by the lamps. Lux is a measure of light intensity, not the amount. 1 lux = 1 lumen per sq meter.

However, lux does give an indication even if not a direct comparison with a normal lamp. Imagine a 10 year old's birthday cake at 1 foot distance. The ten candles will produce a luminance of around 100 lux, that of your larger lamp.

No doubt when LED lamps can provide a useful light oputput the manufacturers will quote their lumen output. Until then caveat emptor!

IP68 transformers on SF as well, 60va for 3 20w or 105va if your putting in five, now shut up about leds

Stoday wrote:

Hoovie wrote:BTW Stoday, were you born a cantankerous old sod, or did you train for it ?

Why??

All I'm trying to do is to help skiking to avoid an expensive mistake.

You still haven't quoted how much light is produced by the lamps. Lux is a measure of light intensity, not the amount. 1 lux = 1 lumen per sq meter.

However, lux does give an indication even if not a direct comparison with a normal lamp. Imagine a 10 year old's birthday cake at 1 foot distance. The ten candles will produce a luminance of around 100 lux, that of your larger lamp.

No doubt when LED lamps can provide a useful light oputput the manufacturers will quote their lumen output. Until then caveat emptor!

Why, well you seem to be fixated on how many lumens a light gives out and there is some sort of conspiracy theory that as LED lamps don't quote them the suppliers are out to fool everyone.

Who gives a monkeys how many lumens!! Either the light output is adequate or it is not - Skiing wants to light an area around his house, not write a thesis on the luminosity of lamps

How expensive is trying out an LED bulb going to be? If the light output is not adequate, get a brighter lamp! if LEDs are not up to job, get a low energy lamp which has the identical fitting! - if THAT is not good enough, get a Halogon lamp which has the same fitting!!
For £10 you could try all the variations!

I was just providing an option route to consider that could use a variety of different light technologies, all using one of the most common lamp fittings around today - available in styles that would probably be suitable for external soffit fittings.

Result? A solution (IMHO) that provides flexibility for just about any likely degree of lighting needs now AND in the future.

So I consider that I was being helpful to address the original question. I feel just about post you have made on this thread has been the opposite. That is my opinion, you are entitled to yours.

Hoovie.

Signing off this thread as can't be arsed any more

Hoovie wrote:
Signing off this thread as can't be arsed any more

But you really wanted to have the last word, didn't you. So you now have either to contradict yourself or not have the last word.

As for the reticence of manufacturers to quote a lumen output, the reason for this is that the lamps are so dim they want to keep quiet about it. The manufacturers of the individual LED diodes always quote their lumen output, so it's very easy for the manufacturers of the lamps to do so too.

Skiking is not so thick that he can't work out that he can try oput different lamps for himself. If he wanted to do that he wouldn't post here to be told that. He'd just do it. He came for advice. That's what I gave him, but for some reason you think I should not have done so because it's different from yours even though it's not incompatible.

I think Hoovie just likes an argument and that's why he wants the last word.

Now let's see if I'm right. Will he no longer post on this thread as he says?

For what its worth I still think the technology is not quite there for LED's is terms of providing sufficient light - altho' its come along way in the last couple of years. I'm a cynic, so when a manufacturer misses out information I'm of the belief they are hiding something so I'm with Stods here.

As for going out and trying different lamps - I could be thick here - I don't have any setup to accept GU10 lamps.

I think my option is to get a suitably rated (IP5n) GU10 fitting that allows me to use traditional GU10 or the LED equivilant. Am I on the right lines here or are there any other options.

Cheers for the responses for far