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Hi guys I'm looking at my options interms of career and was thinking about being an electrician.

I have an electrical engineering degree currently and experience working in industry.

What would be my best route in as an electrician?

The only way to do this properly is to do a proper apprenticeship. Fast track courses may help you pass an exam BUT won't teach you hands on OR how to deal with old and existing installs and how to understand the nuances of the earlier versions of the regulations or wiring methods adopted over the last 60 years.

Then there is all the knowledge you need about the variety of types of constructions, and the plethora of all the types of items installed.

Apologies if this isn't what you want to hear.

Both my son and I did a sidewards move and became electricians/electrical engineers. In my case it was rather gradual, started as a motor vehicle and bridge technician. Found good at electrics and became an auto electrician, I was an expert at repairing portable traffic lights, taught by the manufacturer, and a pump and traffic light firm offered me a job, saying they would teach me pumps.

I then went to work abroad, and it was a case your an electrician fix it, it did not matter if a pipe carrier or a photostat machine, I had to fix it, believe me it was a steep learning curve.

On return to UK my problem was regulations, I by then knew how to fix things, and working on maintenance was OK, but to install new did not know what was allowed, so did a series of night classes, one on regulations, and two on inspecting and testing, also things like PLC programming and most my working life I worked in industry on maintenance.

However in the 70's when I moved from auto electrics to industrial there was no Part P, and computers did not exist, I also had a father-in-law who was an electrical superintendent and a father who was technical manager in a power station so people I could ask, my son got his break due to who I knew, in fact I was head hunted and as a condition for working for them got them to employ my son.

The electrical trade is vast, and I have moved sidewards many times, doing industrial installation, industrial maintenance, and industrial design, including writing the PLC programs to run the machines, I have even done some house bashing.

But if I look back now retired 70 year old, there was never a time where I said I want to be an electrician and started afresh, I was in an allied trade, so was an electrician of some sort when I completed my apprenticeship even if did not start my engineering apprenticeship with that in mind. Yes now I have a degree not a good one, in electrical and electronic engineering, I was only talking to my wife yesterday and saying was required where I volunteer to sign some paperwork so needed to add the letters behind my name, and realised same letters used for sound and vision, motor vehicle, and a host of other engineering degrees, so really they mean nothing.

The problem is when you get it wrong, and we all make mistakes, I am lucky, never taken to court, or sacked due to an error, but that means not found out, it does not mean I never got it wrong, and by the 80's I could show I had a warranty of skill. However others have not been so lucky, when you read some of the court cases one thinks there by the grace of god go I.

The big thing today is the inspection and testing, this means any errors more likely to be found, I was just reading how Pembrokeshire County Council Trading Standards took an electric to court, fined £2600 plus would not do his reputation much good, for not spotting faults, which were not of his making.

Every time we do a job we need to sign it complies, until the 1990's although there were regulations, no one seemed to worry too much, then the 16th edition came out, this was first time the regulations has a BS number, it became BS 7671, however they are still not law, and not retrospective. However HSE rules are retrospective and law, so in the main if BS 7671 is followed then we will not breach HSE rules.

If I wanted to start now, likely the best option is a specialist area, and some thing new, where you can know as much as an electrician of 20 years experience, Two come to mind, solar panels and EV charging points. Both have courses you can take, and I could not as it stands install an EV charging point and claim the government grant for the client as I have not done the course and exam. I may be aware of what needs doing, but not got the bit of paper to say I am aware.

In my day it was the PLC (programmable logic control) people wanted my skills, never short of work. My son it was Cisco systems, and SCADA and being able to diagnosed a problem at work from home with his home PC. I did a little with Cisco systems, and SCADA but not as much as him. You need to look as sidewards moves rather than full re-training, few can afford to do a degree like I did in latter life, I was off work long term sick after an accident at work, and used the time to get my degree.

I thought I was good at maths, until I went to University, maths was my failing, maybe you already have the maths, I clearly don't know. My son although now has a level 5 same as me, had to forgo holidays for around 6 years using them for day release, he also did some house bashing and like me, would never want to go back to doing that, one the pay was low, and to trying to persuade a home owner that he needs this or that to comply with regulations is not easy. I remember him being proud of the money he was earning, but by time the expenses were taken off, and he worked out the true hours he worked, including time to do accounts, collect supplies, etc. Likely he was not getting minimum wage, and was clearly exceeding the working hours permitted.

Home owners want everything cheap, industrial bosses want production, and don't want break downs, so don't want some thing cheap which will fail, do it once and do it right. OK there are exceptions, but I would not want to do house bashing if I could avoid it.

Now you have spelled that out Eric, Deliveroo looks like a good option

DWD

OP - I'm a full time SE spark

My business overheads for this FY to date are nearly £8K - and that's with me owning my van outright!

Do ANY sums VERY carefully before you start spending money

Hi guys I'm looking at my options interms of career and was thinking about being an electrician.

I have an electrical engineering degree currently and experience working in industry.

What would be my best route in as an electrician?

Just one thread per topic please. I've merged your two.

Sorry it was the same

moderator2 wrote: ↑Fri Feb 04, 2022 12:45 pm Just one thread per topic please. I've merged your two.

Sorry it was an identical post. Looks like my phone resent the same thread again


Feel free to delete the second post as it was just an identical post

dewaltdisney wrote: ↑Sat Jan 29, 2022 12:07 pm Now you have spelled that out Eric, Deliveroo looks like a good option

DWD

Not really. I don't know why you guys are so keen to put me off getting into trades stuff like it's impossible to make a career in it. Maybe you're looking to reduce the competition or something.

Shame you don't think encouraging and supporting people is a better way to be. I'm sure there is enough work for everyone.

But either way I'm not gonna be put off trying to build a career in the trades

And I actually have experience already in a lot of the things that Eric mentioned so not sure why you're trying to put me down and say I should work Deliveroo.

Neelix wrote: ↑Sat Jan 29, 2022 8:39 am The only way to do this properly is to do a proper apprenticeship. Fast track courses may help you pass an exam BUT won't teach you hands on OR how to deal with old and existing installs and how to understand the nuances of the earlier versions of the regulations or wiring methods adopted over the last 60 years.

Then there is all the knowledge you need about the variety of types of constructions, and the plethora of all the types of items installed.

Apologies if this isn't what you want to hear.

Hey no problem and thanks for the info.

I'm a bit old to get on an apprenticeship and I doubt the government would fund it as i have a degree already. But I already know a lot more in terms of theory than the apprenticeship would be able to teach.

The hands on aspect of the apprenticeship would be the area of new learning for me. Knowing my way around the electrics in someone's house etc.

Do you think a sparkie would be likely to take me on for a low wage to teach me, like an unofficial apprenticeship?

Deliveroo was tongue in cheek, you seem to be swirling around with different ideas and you need to settle on a plan and stick with it. During my life, I have had second strands of income generated by part-time activities. I grew up in the motor trade and I have always done a few cars privately buying at auctions or the trade, doing them up and retailing them out. Okay, that might be harder to do these days but a lot of people are buying light damage insurance sale cars from Copart and rebuilding them with used spares off eBay and the like. Of course, you need capital, tools, space but you can make decent extra income if you work hard. This is just one example but if you think about it you can make money from auctions, look on YouTube at the people who buy returned goods pallets from UK retailers There are lots of money-making options if you look.

DWD

ericmark wrote: ↑Sat Jan 29, 2022 11:53 am Both my son and I did a...

Hi Eric and thanks for your response and very interesting career history and insights.

To give you an idea of my own background.

I have worked on aircraft, panel wiring of backup generators, manufacturing equipment, and currently work in the hybrid and electric car industry. I have an electrical and electronic engineering degree and have done some of what you mentioned such as PLCs and SCADA.

My job doesn't pay enough basically, so I've been looking into ways to make extra money. Maybe weekends or evenings or occasionally taking annual leave from work.

So far I've managed to find a few jobs doing landscaping and gardening for a few days here and there, which has been a great starting point. But was thinking about if I good get into the electrical side of things.

Your idea of solar panels and charging stations is a good one. I need something that's not a normal 9 to 5 though but more like a business that would benefit from being able to call on someone for extra work every now and then when a need arises.

I've found this type of deal in landscaping and gardening and it worked well.

I don't mind investing a bit of money doing courses for specific skills. Like you mentioned there is a course on charging station installation that I'd need to do to be able to get grants for people? I'd be interested in details of that course.

Basically I'm trying to find ways to make extra money. I don't mind getting a small wage initially whilst I learn and prove my worth and trying to build up to a better wage. I've been taking minimum wage for the landscaping and gardening which has been fine for now whilst I learn and gain experience of the trade.

I'm also thinking of other options like the 18th edition training, which I've not had to do for my own career yet but maybe will help with the house bashing stuff.

Isolating a power supply and ensuring its dead, installing cookers etc this stuff I could do fairly easily if I had the right qualifications if a degree won't count.

I was thinking house bashing might be a good option.

This is a bit more info about me so any advice you have will be appreciated on how viable you think this might be and possible routes forward.

The other side gigs i got by just trying my luck with friends and Facebook groups etc and just advertising and looking for work and being open and honest about my skills and what I'm looking for and finding something that suits.

I find a window cleaner for example yesterday who needs a driver for a 50% cut. I'd have to install a ladder rack on my car and learn the window cleaning trade.

Unfortunately he would need something consistent like a couple days a week or something so it's mainly availability that made that option non viable. Evenings, weekends, occasional holidays etc wouldn't work for him. But I mentioned if he can't find anything then to keep me in mind.

I found a lad starting out in landscaping that was doing his own business and also working for someone else's land scaping business and he wanted someone for occasional work. He needed me the other day so I just took a day off annual leave and went and did a days work for him. He didn't have a car so I helped him move materials etc. Was great. And I learned a thing or two.

Also got a friend who does a gardening business and has a 3 day job of clearing a garden and needs a second person just for that job and maybe similar opportunities in future, so again ideal for me. Will just take 3 days annual leave.

If I can figure out a side gig with my electrical and electronic skills and experience, that will be great but it's about finding opportunities that don't need a full time worker that's the main challenge.

dewaltdisney wrote: ↑Fri Feb 04, 2022 1:07 pm Deliveroo was tongue in cheek, you seem to be swirling around with different ideas and you need to settle on a plan and stick with it. During my life, I have had second strands of income generated by part-time activities. I grew up in the motor trade and I have always done a few cars privately buying at auctions or the trade, doing them up and retailing them out. Okay, that might be harder to do these days but a lot of people are buying light damage insurance sale cars from Copart and rebuilding them with used spares <a href="http://www.ebay.co.uk/" class="skimwords-link" target="_blank" data-skimwords-id="1824897" data-skimwords-word="off%20ebay" data-group-id="0" data-skim-creative="300003" title="Shopping Link Added by SkimWords" occurrence="1" data-skim-node-id="858:Deliveroowastonguein_1" style="">off eBay</a><span style="position: absolute;"></span><span style="position: absolute;"></span> and the like. Of course, you need capital, tools, space but you can make decent extra income if you work hard. This is just one example but if you think about it you can make money from auctions, look on YouTube at the people who buy returned goods pallets from UK retailers There are lots of money-making options if you look.

DWD

Ah OK fair one yeah no worries lol.

The problem with that type of set up is I need to take a lot of risk, buying cars, and I need to have the expertise and tools etc already in place

I'm looking for opportunities that I can just work for someone else for a fairly low wage but learn skills etc.

I made £80 the other day working on someone's land scaping for a one off project and was happy with that.

Learned some new skills like repointing etc.

I guess I'm trying to cast my net wider to find more opportunities out there essentially and that's why it looks like I'm bouncing around different ideas. I'm open to trying different things depending on where the opportunities are. I'm trying to build up experience and skills essentially and make a bit of money and see where it goes

Neelix wrote: ↑Sat Jan 29, 2022 2:06 pm OP - I'm a full time SE spark

My business overheads for this FY to date are nearly £8K - and that's with me owning my van outright!

Do ANY sums VERY carefully before you start spending money

Yeah I completely agree. And I don't have the skills and experience to start a business either. So defo wouldn't consider that. Ideally looking to contribute to someone else's business and learn from them and just take a fairly small wage

Unless you get work from some one like a builder, kitchen fitter, or electrical firm then in the main house bashing does not pay on a part time basis. The big problem is the Part P building regulations and either you use the LABC or become a scheme member.

Before Part P I would do a little of everything, but it costs so much to be a scheme member it is full time domestic electrics or non. In England the rules have changed, but here in Wales the LABC charge £100 plus vat for first £2000 worth of work, which for a full house rewire is OK, but to fit a socket in a kitchen is silly.

I did when Part P started do a few jobs which did not need registering, but the problem was when what looked simple escalated, and one realised it needed LABC involvement, so easy to find you need to register the work.

Technically it is down to home owner to deal with the LABC, and if you issue the minor works or installation certificate then it is up to home owner what they do, but sneaky tricks would not get repeat work, so all or nothing.

So looking for firms to employ you, I found electricians who could work with a PLC are not that common, when I started with a concrete casting firm, they would employ a guy to alter programs when required, and in the main this was wanted when the machines were not running, so weekend was preferred.

The guy had a good bit of work from my firm, until half way through a job he had a heart attack, we as a firm were stuck, and it was this which forced for me a steep learning curve, lucky all ladder logic, but after the event I went to collage and university to learn how it should be done, and the guy did recover and returned to do more work.

Some PLC's had free or cheap leads and software, siemens was a problem when I did it, as software so expensive, firms would not buy it so one could have a look, so a siemens trained guy was like gold dust, mitsubishi everyone seems to have the software.

I know my local garage wants some one to fix his profile cutter, it is old, but complex, and it needs some one with industrial experience to fix it.