Got a few walls and ceilings to paint matt white - Johnstone's vs Tikkurila

[DaveyH]

I can't decide on whether to paint the ceilings with Tikkurila Anti-Reflex 2 and paint the walls with Tikkurila Optiva 3.

or

Paint the ceilings and the walls with Johnstone's Perfect Matt.

By my quick calculations there might be a 25% cost saving by using the 2 Tikkurila paints, but I like the convenience of using the same paint for both walls and ceilings.

Which is the better option? There seems to be loads of reviews about the 2 Tikkurila paints, but not so many of Johnstone's Perfect Matt.

Is there anyone out there who's used both Johnstone's Perfect Matt and the 2 Tikkurila paints, if so how do they compare?

Thanks.

[dynamod]

I've used Tikkurila a few times, and can't help feeling it's just a bit overpriced, and over-marketed for its own good. Yes, it's decent quality and a section of the trade love it, but I can't escape the feeling it's just trying a bit too hard.

I used Johnstone's for a few years, and their emulsions were very nice without being pricey. They were solid, reliable products that just did what was expected of them. Their durables in particular, were really nice.

I'd go with Johnstone's but paint is a very personal choice for many. There are few truly awful paints, and in reality either should work well.

[Tom d'Angler]

I can't decide on whether to paint the ceilings with Tikkurila Anti-Reflex 2 and paint the walls with Tikkurila Optiva 3.

I always use Tikkurila Anti-Reflex 2 on ceilings now. In my view, nothing else comes close. I've never had any issues with it and repeat customers have noticed how much better their ceiling looks now compared to previously when I may have used Dulux or Armstead. Even on very large ceilings where it's impossible to lay it off in just one stroke, there's absolutely no flashing. The stuff really is incredible.

For walls, my go-to is now Tikkurila Vinyl Matt. Like the A-R 2, it's brilliant with no flashing, especially on very high walls like stairwells where laying-off is trickier.

The only fly in the ointment for me is Tikkurila's inconsistency when tinting to another manufacturer's colour - I recently ordered 2 x 10 ltrs tinted to a Dulux colour and the second tub was lighter than the first. Fortunately, the customer didn't notice any difference once the second coat was on and she was very happy with the result. If a customer wants a non-Tikkurila colour then I will use that colour's manufacturer instead of having it matched by Tikkurila, although that doesn't happen very often as the Tikkurila chart has plenty of colours to choose from. I have found that customers are very happy to go with my recommendation, especially when I mention that Tikkurila is a Finish company and say "You know what the Scandinavians are like when it comes to producing top-quality products and value for money..."

I haven't tired Optiva 3 as there have been too many negative reviews on Tikkurila's own Facebook page for me to want to take the risk.

[DaveyH]

I can't decide on whether to paint the ceilings with Tikkurila Anti-Reflex 2 and paint the walls with Tikkurila Optiva 3.

I always use Tikkurila Anti-Reflex 2 on ceilings now. In my view, nothing else comes close. I've never had any issues with it and repeat customers have noticed how much better their ceiling looks now compared to previously when I may have used Dulux or Armstead. Even on very large ceilings where it's impossible to lay it off in just one stroke, there's absolutely no flashing. The stuff really is incredible.

For walls, my go-to is now Tikkurila Vinyl Matt. Like the A-R 2, it's brilliant with no flashing, especially on very high walls like stairwells where laying-off is trickier.

The only fly in the ointment for me is Tikkurila's inconsistency when tinting to another manufacturer's colour - I recently ordered 2 x 10 ltrs tinted to a Dulux colour and the second tub was lighter than the first. Fortunately, the customer didn't notice any difference once the second coat was on and she was very happy with the result. If a customer wants a non-Tikkurila colour then I will use that colour's manufacturer instead of having it matched by Tikkurila, although that doesn't happen very often as the Tikkurila chart has plenty of colours to choose from. I have found that customers are very happy to go with my recommendation, especially when I mention that Tikkurila is a Finish company and say "You know what the Scandinavians are like when it comes to producing top-quality products and value for money..."

I haven't tired Optiva 3 as there have been too many negative reviews on Tikkurila's own Facebook page for me to want to take the risk.

When you paint your Tikkurila Anti-Reflex 2 onto a bare plastered ceiling, do you just mist coat with the Tikkurila Anti-Reflex 2 or do you use the Tikkurila Optiva Primer like the chap in this video?

www.youtube .com/watch?v=tR_XyBrVhFk

[moderator2]

www.youtube.com/watch?v=tR_XyBrVhFk

[Tom d'Angler]

When you paint your Tikkurila Anti-Reflex 2 onto a bare plastered ceiling, do you just mist coat with the Tikkurila Anti-Reflex 2

Yes. 20% water.

[Tom d'Angler]

www.youtube.com/watch?v=tR_XyBrVhFk

Bit of a daft video, for several reasons:

1) Why do so many tradesmen want to be video "stars" these days, especially when their video is instructing potential customers on how to do their own decorating rather than employ the tradesman making the video?
2) If you're going to make a video, why record it when there is a background noise that interferes with the narration?
3) Why say you have to roll in a specific directions because if you don't, you'll "see it"? That makes no sense if you are using A-R 2, unless your work is shoddy and you leave tramlines.
4) Why using top of the range products like Tikkurila yet show that you are using a cheaper brand (Armstead) for the woodwork?

Or, am I missing something...?

(Daniel Nugent - if you're on here I would welcome your comments in a direct message.)

[dynamod]

An awful lot of these 'how to' videos leave me scratching my head if I'm honest. We live in a very visual age, I suppose, but I come from that generation where 'trade secrets' were often talked about, and the notion of telling the public how to do the job would have potentially got you sacked by some employers. I'm maybe showing my age a bit by saying that, but much of this stuff would have never been shown outside trade circles. Times change, I suppose.

Going neat with the primer/mist coat does seem odd, as I've never heard of any primer coat going onto bare plaster at full strength. The main purpose of the mist coat isn't opacity, but is meant to penetrate the porous surface and bind on correctly. That's the whole point of going at 20% dilution. Any water content gets sucked out by the porous surface, leaving a skin of solids, potentially not correctly bound.

Rolling with the light is fair enough, I'd say, but decent paint and proper technique shouldn't make it a necessity. Tramlines are normally a sign of poor application, and if it's really that critical, then mask up and spray it.

EDIT - I'm not criticizing the results of this guy, but some of the details seem a bit non-standard, especially the undiluted mist coat. Top coats can flake over time if the mist coat hasn't penetrated and bound properly. Far too much emphasis is put on the finish coats, when in reality the first is really the most important, given that it's what everything else has to ultimately rely on.

[DaveyH]

When you paint your Tikkurila Anti-Reflex 2 onto a bare plastered ceiling, do you just mist coat with the Tikkurila Anti-Reflex 2

Yes. 20% water.

Thanks.

What percentage of water do you use with the Tikkurila Vinyl Matt for your wall mist coats on bare plaster?

[Tom d'Angler]

What percentage of water do you use with the Tikkurila Vinyl Matt for your wall mist coats on bare plaster?

20%, although I usually use a contract matt (with 20% water added) for mist-coating newly-plastered walls and then two coats of the vinyl matt.