You don't need anti-virus

[Puma]

If you keep your software updated and use a firewall you don't need an anti-virus - this will stop in excess of 99% of all viruses.

All those years faffing around with virus software - I wondered why I hadn't found one in years.

And Ditch

Adobe PDF reader - use Foxit - much smaller and faster
Maybe also MS Office - the free Open Office suite seems fine
and IE - other browsers are usually faster (not sure about the latest edition though)

[Bikergirl]

I run firefox, open office and I'll look at foxit for pdf's.

I would like to abandon Microsoft completely and switch to linux, but I haven't taken the plunge yet. Planning on switching my old laptop first and see what it looks and feels like.

[BillyGoat]

Depends on what kind of firewall you are talking about.

Are you going to create rules for inbound and outbound traffic. Do you know which services, ports and applications REALLY need internet? Without the granular control over these and the constant nagging of "do you want application X to have access to the internet", people get bored VERY quickly and eventually just click YES to everything that pops up, negating any protection.

Besides, a firewall might prevent your data being sent out (joining spambot nets, etc) but it won't protect you from other malicious attacks.

Infected banners on webpages - happens more than you think. If the browser (not just IE, any) isn't patched, you are compromised.

Flash - not using that? SOoooo many attacks from this, in lots of webpages. Again, are you going to stop this (some browsers sandbox this, to prevent the attack damaging the system).

What about email viruses? Protection from socially engineered attacks "Oi, fat head - click this, it's your missis naked.... http://genuine_looking_link"

Those downloads, from the trusted site....mmmm, how can you be sure?

Active X, Java - again, all web attacks.

What about that pen drive your mate gave you? Seen stuff on those, auto launch too.

If you are spending a long time faffing with A/V software, dare I say you are using the wrong package?

And biker Girl, if you don't like it - use something else.

See so many people saying "oooh, it's so terrible!", if it's that bad, don't use it!!

You can wet your feet on a distro you can boot off a pen drive, or DVD - no installation required. You can also run in a virtual machine if you have the software/time.

Lots of FREE VM engines to choose from.

BG

[Puma]

Yes BG I know there is a lot of stuff out there but over 99% all use known exploits and simply don't get through updated software flash, java, ie etc.

I've had a lot of viruses due to bit torrents - I had anti virus installed - but it doesn't work for many unknown exploits. I cleaned them up in about five minutes using Hijack This. The vast majority are pretty minor nuisances. I couldn't find out what percentage actually wiped data.

AV products slow web page loading times by about 4 seconds on heavy pages (see Toms Hardware) as bad as a virus itself.

A good virus writer will make sure it gets through anti-virus.

Basically I should have added the caveat: you don't need anti virus unless you are going to do something stupid like download mystery email attachments and don't have your data backed up somewhere apart from the c drive.

[Pooneil]

I would like to abandon Microsoft completely and switch to linux, but I haven't taken the plunge yet. Planning on switching my old laptop first and see what it looks and feels like.

Do it.

You'll have a few teething problems and some things will take a little time to get used to... but there are a load of flexible solutions and forums full of geeks just waiting to help out.

I'm personally amazed anyone uses anything other than Linux.

[Puma]

I run firefox, open office and I'll look at foxit for pdf's.

I would like to abandon Microsoft completely and switch to linux, but I haven't taken the plunge yet. Planning on switching my old laptop first and see what it looks and feels like.

That sounds like a really good idea... don't know why I haven't thought of it!

[Bikergirl]

I found out a while ago that loads of latin american countries exclusively use free linux based software for all government issue computers, including schools, colleges, universities and all other govt services. They take the view that paying for software licences is a waste- you could pay teachers and nurses instead.

I just dislike giving money hand over fist to multimillionaires.

[Puma]

It has occurred to me that in this country it should be mandatory to use Open Office. I am not sure if there are any features which it is lacking but if would be far cheaper to put them in (if they exist) than for all government institutions and schools etc to use Microsoft. It's pretty darned crazy. Ditto replace Windows of course.

[scot-canuck]

Problem is that for years people wrote macros to increase their productivity in MS Office (and some of these macros are massive - stuff to take information from numerous sources to create business critical reports)
Issue being for a lot of companies is the cost of having the macros (small pieces of code to automate tasks in office) rewritten for Open Office (along with testing them and for some companies ensuring the information is *definetely* accurate) is a lot more than simply paying their MS licence fees for the next 10 years or more.
Plus then there's the joy of Sarbannes Oxley for companies who trade in the USA (Big backside pain), ISO 9000/9001 compliance and other "joys"
Also why so many accountants use certain products - clients use them, HMRC/IRS can open the files, other accountants use them and can open the files created.

Other issue in the UK is that there is a massive installed base of users on windows and a lot of bespoke business applications that were written to run on windows (and lot that were written specifically for IE6) and the rewrite cost for these apps is bonkers as some of them were written in the 1980's and early 90's and many times the documentation is severely lacking, making it a massive task to understand the source code to begin with, the people who wrote it are either - dead, moved on and untraceable or have forgotten what they wrote as it was so long ago.

Moving to Linux....good in theory but a massive undertaking in practice...

Also Linux has been attacked in the past and as soon as you increase the number of users using Linux (or BSD or OS/2 or in fact any other OS) then it becomes a viable target and still doesn't stop social engineering attacks, internet man in the middle attacks, phishing, pharming and more.

Other point of Windows is that the system management tools (the heavy backend stuff that myself and BG likely mess around with) have been getting better and better for years and the newest versions of windows server and desktop editions present administrators with a range of reporting tools that make your life a LOT easier and make troubleshooting a lot less of a pain in the rear. Its also really easy to lock down what users can and can't do, what they can look at online etc and set up alerts if someone does xyz. Stuff that can be done in Linux but nowhere near as easily or as quickly.

The sack of meat in front of the screen is the biggest vulnerability in IT.

[Puma]

Yes there will be issues with switching for sure! But there are a massive number of government departments that do nothing more than email, word and excel - in a really basic "what's a macro" way.. I would be amazed if there weren't some savings to be made. But I suppose that's big business all over.

[northwales4u]

To me, I think it would be a lot easier if there was a universal general file system that works across all platforms. For example if I wanted to send my accounts spreadsheet to the accountant, because I use Linux I have to convert it to MS Excel format and then double check I am sending it in the same version of MS Excel that he is using. I know this is a very easy task but its amazing how it can be a hurdle to many users. I can understand there will be copyright issues involved but I think if, for example, you've done a word processing document you should be able to just save it with a generic file extension (say .doc) and sent it to anyone and they can open it with no problems regardless if they are using MS Word 95, MS Word 2025, LibraOffice Writer or whatever.

One problem about using Linux in schools, colleges etc is that if you see job adverts for admin is always asks for experience using MS Office. I think if SME's used Linux for their PC needs it would free up a lot of money for them and they basically just use Office and email - the differences between MS Office and Open Office aren't that much and it doesn't take long to adjust to either one.

[Pooneil]

To me, I think it would be a lot easier if there was a universal general file system that works across all platforms...

That sums up my general resistance to MS. I don't have a real user issue (though windows tends to be very overbloated), but I do have issues with massive monopolies cornering the market by smothering the competition. This is not a free market.

[BillyGoat]

To me, I think it would be a lot easier if there was a universal general file system that works across all platforms...

That sums up my general resistance to MS. I don't have a real user issue (though windows tends to be very overbloated), but I do have issues with massive monopolies cornering the market by smothering the competition. This is not a free market.

I really don't understand the dislike for Microsoft sometimes, I really don't.

People complain that it's bloated, yet if the features were removed it would then get lambasted for not providing or removing things 'people have paid for'.

It's got to be capable of living on an infinite amount of computers and hardware combinations, so there is obviously going to be a sizeable driver library built in, plus the mountain of features/services and other stuff used to make the machine usable.

I also don't understand why people dislike Windows so much. It's a standard operating system, it means you can move from one computer to the next, without having to learn a new shell, command parameters, different bootloaders, interfaces, system for downloading and installing applications or even the need in some instances to compile your own version - how many would ask their parents to do this (I fear the day my parents WANT to use something else).

As a company, they provide jobs to LOTS of people both directly and indirectly in the computer world - is this a bad thing?

There are free alternatives, as you are all aware - but I question if they are REALLY the correct choice in a commercial environment. What happens when a user needs support with these 'free' alternatives? Do they get told to go online, search some forums for an answer? Is that what you would be expect to hear from the support line? Oh wait, there is no support line......

Microsoft have different licencing structures for education and large organisations - these can be quite compelling. It allows kids and adults to learn a system that is in wide use across the world. There are established tools and system in place for deployment, management and control of these networks and an abundance of people who can use these tools as well, thus reducing your down time - important for any business.

If it is business we are talking about, there are also things like TechNet subscriptions where you are get access to everything you need. It can work out a great package for SME to always have the latest and greatest. I know some people who are STILL buying XP - get with the times!!

I also go to companies that use these free solutions. Usually "they work". The person who set them up is usually the only person who knows the system. It's their baby. They rarely share any details about it, nothing is written. IT's not standard in any way shape or form. If they get hit by a bus - what happens to the business. I tell you what happens.....for the first day/week/month it's all ok, then something goes wrong and the "free" solution comes crumbling the ground or they have to spend a fortune on a special support contract to get them running. Not so free in the long run.

As for third world places, there are also different version of Windows - some of these are free to certain markets, not seen that mentioned anywhere. They are restricted to Geo's so I suspect you wouldn't have seen them.....where would the hate be if that was bounded around?

It just confuses me, that if a company makes a great product they are too big and nasty. If your business got REALLY successful, would you want to coated in tar and feathers for making money? I don't know about you, but I want to make LOTS of cash.....what's wrong with that?

BG (who is very grumpy and hung over)

[BillyGoat]

Other issue in the UK is that there is a massive installed base of users on windows and a lot of bespoke business applications that were written to run on windows (and lot that were written specifically for IE6) and the rewrite cost for these apps is bonkers as some of them were written in the 1980's and early 90's and many times the documentation is severely lacking, making it a massive task to understand the source code to begin with, the people who wrote it are either - dead, moved on and untraceable or have forgotten what they wrote as it was so long ago.

Oooh, ain't that the truth!

I know of one such company who has their ENTIRE company built on such a system. If it ever died, it would quite literally bring a multinational to it's knees.

No stock control
No reporting
No repairs
No parts and inventory
No trading results/information

Nothing, nada, zip, diddly squat.

At the very heart of it, it's running on a unix system - only the brave and stupid dare poke the beast with a stick. Break the beast and expect your P45 to appear faster than Vanessa Feltz at mention of an all you can eat buffet.

I guess that is the problem of a growing company - it's often the IT budget that is first to be cut, afterall "it all works perfectly", doesn't it?

As long as the director has an iPad in his hand - the company LOOKS cutting edge.

B "Really on a rant tonight" G

[northwales4u]

To me, I think it would be a lot easier if there was a universal general file system that works across all platforms...

That sums up my general resistance to MS. I don't have a real user issue (though windows tends to be very overbloated), but I do have issues with massive monopolies cornering the market by smothering the competition. This is not a free market.

I really don't understand the dislike for Microsoft sometimes, I really don't. - snipped- People complain that it's bloated
I know some people who are STILL buying XP - get with the times!!

i have no problems with Microsoft - their OS works perfectly on my 360 but they don't provide a solution for my PC needs. I have an old-ish PC and all I use it for is surfing, email and the usual Office apps - WP, DB,SS. If I were to have Windows on this PC with MS Office, anti-virus etc it would be so slow that it would take forever to boot up. With Linux its so lean and quick the PC takes less than a minute to boot up and does exactly what I want - it is the right system for me without having to shell out £100 for an OS, £400 for an Office package etc