www.ultimatehandyman.co.uk

sounds a bit extreme! They've been up 2 months, and only a few cracks in the tile glaze, i'd say they are aren't that bad, don't forget I put quite a few masonry nails in the boards at different angles.

I also don't see the point of taking them totally off of the wall, as I'd only be screwing them anyway, and the plasterboard adhesive which is on is now holding them the correct distance from the wall, so i'll use that almost as a spacer, so going to remove tiles, clean everything up, put around 6 screws with washers through the boards into the solid wall with rawl plugs, which will obviously prevent the boards from moving any further, and then tiles back on again.

Soon as the weather warms up again, i'll get going with it.

haveagohero wrote:Those tiles and boards need to come down ASAP! the boards are clearly coming off the wall if there are cracks in the tiles at the joint between the boards, just putting screws in will not do a lot to remedy this. Think about the weight on each panel, if one falls off (which it will very soon) and falls on someone they will be very lucky if they don't end up in hospital or worse! swallow your pride, take it all down and do it properly before anyone uses that bathroom again!

Also, forgot to mention, one end of one board is behind the coving, and the other end of the other board is behind the bath, and on the other wall, there are things screwed through the boards anyway (radiator, mirror etc), and those screws are doing a fine job of holding these panels in place (no cracked tiles at all).

There have been a lot of 'you are doomed' posts on this thread but is it that bad? I think you know in your heart that you are facing a rip off at some point and anything you do now will be a temporary fix to extend the point in time when you will have to hack it off. I can imagine you are pretty gutted and hoped that the chaps on here would come up with an easy solution to this problem bad sadly there are none.

I think you need to take heed of the danger mentioned of tiles popping off that might hurt someone but I am sure you will be able to assess this probability as time goes on.

So chin up mate, formulate your plans and take it all in your stride.

DWD

dewaltdisney wrote:There have been a lot of 'you are doomed' posts on this thread but is it that bad? I think you know in your heart that you are facing a rip off at some point and anything you do now will be a temporary fix to extend the point in time when you will have to hack it off. I can imagine you are pretty gutted and hoped that the chaps on here would come up with an easy solution to this problem bad sadly there are none.

I think you need to take heed of the danger mentioned of tiles popping off that might hurt someone but I am sure you will be able to assess this probability as time goes on.

So chin up mate, formulate your plans and take it all in your stride.

DWD

Yeah, i'm gutted, though I think i'm over that stage now :) I know it needs to be sorted, and it'll be getting done as soon as warmer weather is here, if it were april/may now, i'd be getting on with it, just unfortunate, that I did the bathroom in September.

I'm going round on an almost daily basis checking the tiles (everytime I hear a noise!), so I'll defo not take my eye off them anytime soon, and if the need becomes more urgent, then I'll have to sort it sooner.

Just leave it up it'll be fine, what do I know its not like I do it for a living and my company do around 100 bathroom installs a year. Bet you wish you'd spent the extra few quid and just used adhesive to fix the boards now though ey

I think the OP has realised his mistake, no need to beat him up anymore.

For what it's worth it looks like he made a really nice job of the bathroom so well done there

Sadly that probably just makes it worse

dewaltdisney wrote:There have been a lot of 'you are doomed' posts on this thread but is it that bad? I think you know in your heart that you are facing a rip off at some point and anything you do now will be a temporary fix to extend the point in time when you will have to hack it off. I can imagine you are pretty gutted and hoped that the chaps on here would come up with an easy solution to this problem bad sadly there are none.

I think you need to take heed of the danger mentioned of tiles popping off that might hurt someone but I am sure you will be able to assess this probability as time goes on.

So chin up mate, formulate your plans and take it all in your stride.

DWD

One lesson I did learn from the old boys actually, “leave it if its anyway ok”

I had a similar issue. In my old flat the bathroom tiles were starting to lift but only about 7 years later did I actually get round to tackling it. Just stripped them off and redid but at that stage the bathroom needed a redoing. Similarly I remember people telling me that I needed to strip off old plaster as it was sounding hollow and would move . It had been there for donkeys year. A old boy urged me not to touch it until its starts falling as I’d be opening myself up for a lot of work. The whole lot was covered in wood chip and 8 years later its still ok.

My dad had same issue in a house. Old lath plaster and he still managed to get 30 years out of the place

Guess depends on how much it bothers you and how dangerous it actually. If it was wiring it would be a different story

DIY_Johnny wrote:

dewaltdisney wrote:There have been a lot of 'you are doomed' posts on this thread but is it that bad? I think you know in your heart that you are facing a rip off at some point and anything you do now will be a temporary fix to extend the point in time when you will have to hack it off. I can imagine you are pretty gutted and hoped that the chaps on here would come up with an easy solution to this problem bad sadly there are none.

I think you need to take heed of the danger mentioned of tiles popping off that might hurt someone but I am sure you will be able to assess this probability as time goes on.

So chin up mate, formulate your plans and take it all in your stride.

DWD

One lesson I did learn from the old boys actually, “leave it if its anyway ok”

I had a similar issue. In my old flat the bathroom tiles were starting to lift but only about 7 years later did I actually get round to tackling it. Just stripped them off and redid but at that stage the bathroom needed a redoing. Similarly I remember people telling me that I needed to strip off old plaster as it was sounding hollow and would move . It had been there for donkeys year. A old boy urged me not to touch it until its starts falling as I’d be opening myself up for a lot of work. The whole lot was covered in wood chip and 8 years later its still ok.

My dad had same issue in a house. Old lath plaster and he still managed to get 30 years out of the place

Guess depends on how much it bothers you and how dangerous it actually. If it was wiring it would be a different story

One of those boards loaded with tiles, adhesive and grout could be getting on for 40kg, if the bond on one of the top boards failed and it fell on your head you would be in serious trouble.

They may have nails through them but the nail heads will just pull through the boards

He is using washers and plugs in solid walls and the boards are on the wall not on the ceiling. I’m aware I’ve no business recommending anything, as I am not a fitter but personally I can’t see how it will come crashing down unexpectedly one day without any warning. Might loosen but you guys know best obviously

If it was my house I'd put it down to experience and do the same thing as the OP and have it noted as a future job needing doing.

DIY_Johnny wrote:He is using washers and plugs in solid walls and the boards are on the wall not on the ceiling. I’m aware I’ve no business recommending anything, as I am not a fitter but personally I can’t see how it will come crashing down unexpectedly one day without any warning. Might loosen but you guys know best obviously

If it was my house I'd put it down to experience and do the same thing as the OP and have it noted as a future job needing doing.

Not using Washers and Plugs as yet, this is where i'm heading for when I re-do. Currently adhesive and nails. The board is propped up though as I say, even if the above fail. We would notice the coving moving before the board came down, since it goes right behind it. I'll keep a close eye.

Boards screwed with washers to a solid wall will never move unless the screws fail, which is unlikely, as I'll use suitably coated ones. It would be no different to screwing to a timber frame, which is what board manufacturers recommend it seems

Thought I'd add to this post rather than making a new one, since its all to do with this on-going issue. So far I've not done any work on this, and it is still to be done this year when the weather gets better, but I've got some more questions.

Firstly I've no idea how difficult or easy its going to be to get the tile adhesive off of the cement boards, most of it is acrylic adhesive, which should soften when wetted?? There is a small amount of cement based rapid set adhesive on some of the boards though, not sure how this will act when wetted? I plan to take the tiles off, clean the boards, drill through into the wall, then use plugs in the wall, and screws and washer to spread the load, does this sound sensible? As another level, I also plan to inject expanding foam into the "cavity" behind the boards, in order to stabilise them from moving.

My biggest question is as follows. I've been over the tiles with an LED torch, and it shows up every single crack and craze going, and trust me, there are plenty, as im sure you'd guess. My biggest concern is, that there are plenty of tiles which don't sit on joins, and therefore should have no movement whatsoever, yet this have just as many cracks in as the ones which are sat on joins?!?!? Now this I don't get, unless the boards are somehow flexing, and I can't imagine they are? Can anyone suggest how this could have happened, is it something to do with my non-flexible adhesive? Has anyone else had a tile which has cracked, which is on one single solid surface. And theres not just 1 or 2 that's done this, theres loads of them throughout the bathroom! I've even got a few with crazing on the wall that I did correctly, with wood battens, and screwed boards? I don't want to be in a position of re-doing the job, and ending up in the same place afterwards, after putting in yet more effort to rectify the issue, I'd like to know what the cause of this cracking/crazing is on single boards.

I've read that dot and dab with cement boards is common place, but only when people drill through the dried adhesive, and screw the boards to the wall, which I plan to do.

Any info/advice would be great, as I plan to tackle this wall by wall in the coming months, starting with the worst wall, next to the bath.

Thanks
Mike

You are going to end up in a whole world of pain.

Basically you have a massively bodged job and one which if done by a 'tradesmen' would have everyone telling you not to pay him a penny for the work.

It isn't just a case of taking off a few tiles, putting some screws through the aquapanel and then tiling again. The aquapanel is going to be damaged to the point of making it useless as a tiling background, when you take off tiles and adhesive. Trust me, I have had to correct a persons bodge with a cement board background.

The more I read this thread, the more I agree with royaloakcarpentry - bite the bullet and rip it all off, or you'll regret it for years.

If that bathroom were mine, I'd seriously consider cement-rendering that block wall nice and flat, and draping it with a plastic sheet for a few months while it cures fully - then you'll have the perfect tiling surface, and plenty of time to read the instructions on various adhesives before re-doing it, and it doesn't cost much.

You say you've got tiles cracking in other parts of the bathroom - what space did you leave between tiles when you first stuck them on the wall? Only reason I ask is that many years ago I bought some tiles with rounded edges, and the man in the shop (how I'd love to meet him again), told me that these tiles didn't need spacers, to just stick them on the wall touching each other, and the rounded edges would leave a nice line for grouting. It looked fine for a few months, then they all started cracking. The shop closed down before I went back.

Tiles are hard, brittle things and even the minute amount of thermal expansion and contraction they undergo in a bathroom is enough to crack them if there's no room at all for them to move.

And please, for goodness' sake, don't squirt expanding foam behind that board - it'll quite likely push the board off the wall. If you're determined to carry on with your plan to bodge this job, squirt some sort of gap-filling grab adhesive in there - and give it a very long time to cure, as there'll be virtually no air getting to it once you've applied it.

Good luck

Chris Skilbeck wrote:

You are going to end up in a whole world of pain.

Basically you have a massively bodged job and one which if done by a 'tradesmen' would have everyone telling you not to pay him a penny for the work.

It isn't just a case of taking off a few tiles, putting some screws through the aquapanel and then tiling again. The aquapanel is going to be damaged to the point of making it useless as a tiling background, when you take off tiles and adhesive. Trust me, I have had to correct a persons bodge with a cement board background.

The more I read this thread, the more I agree with royaloakcarpentry - bite the bullet and rip it all off, or you'll regret it for years.

If that bathroom were mine, I'd seriously consider cement-rendering that block wall nice and flat, and draping it with a plastic sheet for a few months while it cures fully - then you'll have the perfect tiling surface, and plenty of time to read the instructions on various adhesives before re-doing it, and it doesn't cost much.

You say you've got tiles cracking in other parts of the bathroom - what space did you leave between tiles when you first stuck them on the wall? Only reason I ask is that many years ago I bought some tiles with rounded edges, and the man in the shop (how I'd love to meet him again), told me that these tiles didn't need spacers, to just stick them on the wall touching each other, and the rounded edges would leave a nice line for grouting. It looked fine for a few months, then they all started cracking. The shop closed down before I went back.

Tiles are hard, brittle things and even the minute amount of thermal expansion and contraction they undergo in a bathroom is enough to crack them if there's no room at all for them to move.

And please, for goodness' sake, don't squirt expanding foam behind that board - it'll quite likely push the board off the wall. If you're determined to carry on with your plan to bodge this job, squirt some sort of gap-filling grab adhesive in there - and give it a very long time to cure, as there'll be virtually no air getting to it once you've applied it.

Good luck

Used the smallest tiles spacers (I think) you can get between the tiles, which I think are right, they were sold as wall tile spacers. When I've taken the tiles off, if the boards are damaged I'll replace them, I've plenty more in the garage.

The expanding foam was only going to be used once the boards had a firm fixing with screws and washers in to the block, so therefore wouldn't be pushed off of the wall. I wouldn't dream of doing it without additional fixings.

I can't use your method of cement rendering the wall, for one I wouldn't be able to do it straight, and for another, there'd be a huge gap between the wall and the bath, as the wall isn't 100% straight.

I'm not too concerned about the method for moving forward, I've learnt where I've gone wrong from all the posts to this thread, but my main concern is why tiles which don't sit on joins are getting crazing to the glaze, as I don't want to do this again, to find it happens again.

Thanks